CNN host Chris Wallace challenged The New York Times reporter Lulu Garcia-Navarro’s defense of Vice President Kamala Harris, igniting a broader debate on Harris’s political positions and the rhetoric used against her by critics.

During a discussion on “The Chris Wallace Show” about the Harris campaign’s strategic shift away from focusing on former President Donald Trump as a “threat” to democracy, Garcia-Navarro expressed frustration with Republican criticisms labeling Harris as “far-left.” Wallace, however, remained unconvinced, leading to an exchange over Harris’s political identity and the ongoing rhetoric surrounding her.

“I have to say that I am so exhausted with the idea that she’s so far left and that she’s a communist. They tried this with Biden in 2020. ‘Biden’s a communist, if he gets into power, the entire country is going to collapse!’ I mean, this is something I hear in Miami all the time,” Garcia-Navarro said.

“She’s said a lot of pretty far-left things in 2019,” Wallace answered. Garcia-Navarro acknowledged that Harris has pivoted from some of those earlier positions, but emphasized that her past statements should not define her current political standing.

“Biden was not a communist, the country hasn’t fallen into communism, and I will say that she in 2019 said some things that definitely fall into the progressive camp, which she has now recanted — ” Garcia-Navarro told Wallace.

Podcaster Kara Swisher quickly interjected and voiced frustration with the scrutiny Harris faces. “It’s never good enough! Donald Trump could—” she began, before Wallace interrupted.

“No, wait a minute, you had this view on decriminalization, she had this view, what’s your explanation? My values haven’t changed,” Wallace said. Garcia-Navarro returned to the central issue and said that while she agreed that Harris should be questioned on her policy views, she was adamant that labeling her as a communist crossed a line.

“There is a real question about what does Kamala Harris actually believe and that I think is a fair question to be pressed on. I’m not saying that it isn’t. What I’m saying is not fair is just the extrapolation from that, that somehow she is the next sort of Mao Zedong that’s going to come over here,” Garcia-Navarro explained.

Wallace ended the heated exchange by pivoting away from the topic. “I don’t think anybody’s saying that, but anyway,” he said.

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